Summary
Event: THB leaders and representatives meeting
Meeting Place: Thunderbrew Distillery in Kharanos
Meeting Date: Sunday, October 5th, 2008
Meeting Time: 15:00 CET (Game Time) to 17:35 CET.
Proposed Agenda
- Welcome
- Looting Rules
Actual Agenda
- Welcome
- Looting Rules
Final Attendees
- Co-Coordinators
- Wandjina - Roses of Dawn
- Elsheindra - The One (Guild Leader)
- CursedCrusaders
- Aelhaern (Guild Leader)
- Laraelia
- Moonsugar
- Phoenix Legion
- The One
- Roses of Dawn
- Ye Olde Geezers
- Cannonfodder
- Jazhara (Guild Leader)
Final Decisions/Major Points
Notes by Elsheindra and Basil
- Welcome
- Looting Rules
- Set completion. Current rule gives someone priority if they're getting the last item of a set. This goes back to "Old World" raiding where set completion bonuses were quite good. This is not the case anymore and doesn't look to be the case in Wrath.
- Decision: Agreed to remove this from the looting rules.
- Stats for paladin tanks. Cannonfodder (YoG) confirms that, after talking to Jeanda and Enrico, tanking paladins, that paladins find +spell damage useful, so should paladins be added to relevant items (weapons, rings, trinkets) as primary rollers?
- Roles for enhancement shaman. Basil said in proposed rule changes that obvious this is a physical DPS specification and elemental is a caster DPS spec. Remove enhancement shaman off tanking list.
- Decision: Elemental Shammy is a DPS Caster. Enhancement Shammy is subject to a further check to see if they are viable as tanks in Wrath of the Lich King
- Option 1: first visit is training run and you cannot roll on items unless the items would otherwise be sharded.
- Cannonfodder (YoG) asks if it's per person or per character?
- Decision: The first time a player visits an instance, it's a training run and they are unable to roll on items unless the items would otherwise be sharded. They are tertiary rollers (see below)
- Option 2: People attending raid will be gear-checked for their spec against be.imbu.hu. If they're not geared to perform well in the instance then they are not eligible to roll unless the item would otherwise be sharded. They are tertiary rollers (see below)
- Basil suggests we have three types of loot eligibility: primary specification eligibility, secondary eligibility, and tertiary eligibility.
Primary rollers are rolling for main spec items and meet all eligeability criteria.
Secondary rollers are off-spec or do not meet one of the eligeability criteria. They get a roll if no primary rollers want the item.
Tertiary rollers get a roll if neither primary or secondary rollers want an item and before something is sharded.
This seems to be agreeable.
- Decision: We will have three classes of eligibility rolls. Primary where they meet all the requirements for raiding in that instance and are rolling for gear on their primary specification/role. Secondary, which includes off-specification and people who are undergeared but who have been asked to come along by the raid leader, and tertiary where the item would otherwise be sharded, which is people along for the first time or who are not appropriately geared for the particular instance.
- Option 3: Account for gemming/enchanting equipment and coming prepared with elixirs and appropriate buff food, etc.
- Basil points out that gems/enchants are considered by be.imba.
- Decision: You're expected to have at least green gems for all your items, the exception is if you've recently obtained a single item. Vendor gems count as ungemmed. If someone is undergemmed, they drop down in the rolling priority.
- Decision: Raid leaders (or others, like a lootmaster) to check people at start of raid and announce what categories people are in for that raid.
- Decision: We won't formally consider enchants, but will encourage people to get appropriate enchants for their gears.
- Decision: As a general rule, people are expected to have food/elixir/flask buffs as relevant on bosses. If people regularly forget it, then raid leaders are free to not invite that person and people will be informed of this. This doesn't apply if someone is asked to swap in a character at the last minute.
- Options 4: Account for people's ability/focus shown in raids. Some raids we've had people doing less damage than the tank, for example.
- Decision: Nice idea but the practicality is very difficult to implement fairly. As it's not workable this will not be adopted.
- DKP Systems: Suicide Kings and DKP systems explained. Elsheindra (The One) points out that DKP-like systems are not compatible with the underlying ideals of the Honourbound Alliance as a social, casual raiding alliance. Moonsugar (CC) thinks it's a lot of work to maintain DKP and similar systems and neither system accommodates alt characters very well. Cannonfodder says most people he's discussed DKP with have been negative.
- Popcorn (TO) suggests three lists: high, medium, and low priority. High priority to get to go first. Then medium. Then low priority. The priority groups are based on where the people fit in the list.
- Gimlinox (PL) asks if there would be a separate list for healers/tanks. Basil extends that to would there be a list per character or a list per person.
- Elsheindra says that it's different if a raid leader asks you to bring an alternate.
- Moonsugar (CC) comments that we're seeing many PvP geared people coming in and taking away PvE gear which she doesn't think is right either. Discussion about how people should be gearing up.
- Decision: Basil and Cannonfodder to investigate Suicide Kings more.
- Multiple specs and loot: big discussion about this and how current rules work and some possible workarounds. End decision is to leave well enough alone and re-visit in Wrath of Lich King, if necessary.
Note: The public version of these notes was posted more than 6 months after the meeting, so some of this may not be relevant anymore. – Elsheindra
Elsheindra
